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howto:named_outfits wiki (formerly "WIP Guide to Gacha Game Tagging")

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Damian0358 said:

Given the fact that the wiki will seemingly orient itself around games in general, not just gacha games, a slight rewrite of the start might be necessary.

Some of my wording may be repetitious, but I think it's a good start.

It's too wordy IMO, Keep it Simple

Damian0358 said:

Some of my wording may be repetitious, but I think it's a good start.

Mexiguy said:

It's too wordy IMO, Keep it Simple

It's an improvement, but on hindsight the Terminology segment could be nixed altogether, and an explanation of gacha elements can just be linked to the gashapon wiki. The intro could then be reworked to:

Throughout recent years, there lacked a means of standardizing how alternate costumes for characters in games should be tagged on Danbooru, mainly those in gashapon games. The conventions that work for one title...

I also added the howto:named outfits wiki to the List of Meta-Wikis.

Here is my proposed change for the wiki

Show

This wiki is still a WIP, and it's ruleset hasn't been applied yet. See forum #17377 for the relevant discussion.

Intro and notes for the WIP

Throughout recent years, there has been lack of an agreed standard on how alternate costumes for characters games with gacha/lootbox mechanics should be handled on Danbooru. This has lead to each franchise having its own de facto standard, mostly due to the fact that a system that works for one title may not necessarily work so for another. This has led to confusion and inconsistencies (not only between franchises, but sometimes within a franchise itself like in the case of Fate), this is caused in great part by users who may or may not be familiar with the inner workings of each particular game and the lack of established tagging conventions, which leads them to make their own decision or just follow by example. The goal of this project is to define a single basic standard for tagging characters and skins/outfits that can be easily be adapted to any new or existing franchise with gacha mechanics wile remaining consistent with each other.

Note: Due to its unique circumstances when it comes to character and costumes , Fate/Grand Order is being discussed separately it is unclear at the moment if this system will be also used for FGO or if a specific system will be adopted, as such, this article has deliberately excluded any examples from that game. Please go to topic #17356 ("The Fate/Grand Retagging Project") discussion regarding tagging conventions for F/GO specifically.

The proper wiki draft follows:

Table of Contents

This is a guide on how to tag characters and alternate costumes from games with gacha-style mechanics

What is a "gacha-style" game

Gacha (ガチャ) is shorthand for gachapon (ガチャポン) (sometimes also called gashapon (ガシャポン)) and is a type of Japanese vending machine that dispenses a plastic capsule containing a randomly-selected toy or prize. Usually this is toy is a part of a collectible set, incentivizing customers to keep spending until the get the complete collection

Similarly a gacha-style game (usually shortened to gacha game or just plain gacha) is a video game in which players spend either real life money or an in-game currency in exchange for randomized prizes either by directly spending on a random prize (also known as rolling) or via in-game containers with randomized prices (usually known as lootboxes. Said prizes tend to be additional characters, alternate vwrsions characters, alternate costumes (also known as skins), weapons, etc. Since Danbooru is a character-based imageboard the discussion is going to center around characters and outfits, please note that these conventions are not exclusive to mobile games or what people usually consider "gacha games", many console and PC games use similar systems for releasing characters and alternate forms/outfits. This guide focuses primarily on gacha games due to their massive popularity in recent years (particularly in the East) and the large amount of art that results from that, but these guidelines also apply to games using similar systems regardless of the platform of genre.

What makes tagging characters from a gacha game different

Danbooru's tagging guidelines when it comes to characters are If it talks, acts on its own, or is otherwise shown to be sentient in the source material (game, anime, manga, novel), it is a character and If a character has alternate identities or forms which are visually distinct, these are tagged as well using the official name or the fan-agreed name, if there is no official one (see howto:tag and howto:character), this however has caused quite a lot of confusion and inconsistencies when it comes to tagging characters and costumes from gacha games, due to the complex way in which gacha games often treat and release characters, alternate costumes, and/or alternate forms, in particular the way in which some games treat costumes independently from characters but gives costumes specific names, while other games treat existing characters wearing a different outfit as a completely different character (often giving them a different in-game ID number and/or giving them different, stats, skills and character classes, etc).

This is in stark contrast with other forms of media, which usually don't name alternate outfits. For example, the swimsuit that Yoko Littner wears inTengen Toppa Gurren Lagann's beach episode (post #178763) or the black dress that Tomoe Hotaru from Bishoujo Senshi Sailor Moon' (post #2227732) which she's often depicted wearing, neither of which is given special treatment or even given a specific name. Compare with Azur Lane's Sirius, who has a swimsuit that is officially named Midsummer Seirios (post #3529663). Since it's a visually distinctive form and is given an official name then it's given its own tag according to danbooru's guidelines.

Definition of "character variant"

According to Danbooru's character tagging guidelines If a character has alternate identities or forms which are visually distinct, these are tagged for the purpose of this guide said alternative identities, as well as named outfits will be referred to as a "character variants", other terms used to refer to variants are forms, versions, skinsand alternate costumes

Some games release alternate outfits in the form of character skins. In gaming terms, this is an alternate costume that only serves to function as a cosmetic change for a character, without changing the character's in-game functionality. If a skin has been given an official name, it may be considered a variant for tagging purposes.

[Further discussion is needed regarding an outfit that was initially released without a name, then retroactively given a name later in the franchise's life, and whether or not it should be likewise retroactively tagged with a new character tag. While this is uncommon, it does happen.
- Benit149
]

"TAGGING GUIDELINES":

Character Variants

"Default" variant: The first or variant of a character to be released, or the "base" variant of a character in the case of games with upgrade trees is considered to be the "default" variant of the character and is named according to the usual naming guidelines (e.g. sirius_(azur_lane)

Variants with official names: For variants with an official name a new tag must be created with the variant name as a qualifier, if the character name has a copyright qualifier then the said qualifier must go after the variant qualifier (e.g. sirius_(midsummer_seirios)_(azur_lane)), therefore the template for named variants is: character_name_(variant_name)[_(copyright)].

Holiday variants and special costume variants with no official name: For seasonal/holiday variants with no official name and variants with a specific identifiable costume (kimono, raincoat, santa outfit, etc) but no specific name the season/holiday or the costume should be used as the qualifier (e.g Character_Name_(Haloween) or Character_Name_(Kimono))

All variants must imply the default variant tag, this is to allow people to quickly search for all posts of a character regardless of variant (e.g. sirius_(azur_lane) or to exclude a particular variant of a character while keeping the rest (e.g. sirius_(azur_lane) -sirius_(midsummer_seirios)_(azur_lane))

[There is some debate as to whether or not the default should get the same treatment as the holiday variant for consistency’s sake, or if it’s best to just leave them as is. At the moment, the default is left as-is.
- Benit149
]

Character Upgrades

Some games have a mechanic where the characters may upgraded, resulting in design changes ranging to minor alterations to their default outfit, to compeltely different outfits, to even some major design overhauls for these cases a general tag for the game mechanic is used, rather than new individual character tags, some examples are Kantai Collection remodels, Azur Lane retrofits and Girls Frontline MOD3,

Shared Costumes

Some games (particularly idol games) have instances where multiple characters will wear the same costume as a sort of uniform or as a part of a collection set (barring minor design changes for individual characters), these outfits too are given general tags rather than individual character tags, some examples are Idolmaster's Cute & Girly,and Cool & Sexy outfits and the maid cafe collection from School Idol Festival.

[More discussion is needed as to whether or not it is desirable to leave it like this or to expand them as chartags. The crux of the [argument is that gentags wind up getting 'lost' in the quagmire of dozens of other gentags describing everything in an image, while making chartags for every instance is far too cumbersome and pedantic.
- Benit149
]

Characters cosplaying as a specific variant of another character

For character cosplaying as a specific variant of another character you must add [[/b]both[/b] the default variant and the specific variant *_(cosplay) tags (e.g. if a character is wearing Sirus' swimsuit you must add both the sirius_(azur_lane)_(cosplay) and sirius_(midsummer_seirios)_(azur_lane)_(cosplay))

Characters from Existing Copyrights

Quite often already existing characters with their proper tag on Danbooru are added to games as gacha prizes, In these cases the already existing character tag should be used instead of creating a new tag, if said character receives additional game-specific variations the variations should be tagged as per the above mentioned guidelines, already existing art of the character are NOT to be tagged with the gacha copyright tag and, new uploads should only be tagged with the gacha copyright only if

  • The image in question contains a game-specific variant of the character
  • The image in question makes specific reference to a situation from the game (e.g elements of the game interface being present on the image, game-specific dialog being quoted or references being made to a game-specific situation)
  • A game-specific character is present in the image
  • The character is wearing a game-exclusive outfit but it isn't tagged as a variant

[The last point is debatable, it is mostly in place because that used to be the official or the de facto policy for most gacha, see love live! school idol festival
-Mexiguy
]

List of Games with Named Outfits

This is an ongoing work-in-progress. Any contributions made will be greatly appreciated, as previously stated Fate/Grand Order is being discussed separately, and it's not to be included in this list

<List cut>

Updated

One minor suggestion I'd make is that all mentions of F/GO should be broadened to the Fate franchise in general, just in case anyone tries to argue that named outfits which originated in Fate/Extra, Fate/Extella, etc (and which usually end up in F/GO later) should be accommodated within the policy proposal or included on the list because it doesn't explicitly say they shouldn't be.

Hopefully no one is that keen on splitting hairs, but you never know.

Hi, I've read the wiki and got some questions and how Honkai Impact 3rd could fit in it. If it seems like I missed anything then feel free to correct me.

You see, Honkai is kinda special in all this costume talk. The majority of armors seen in the game are widely produced, which means those aren't unique to the characters wearing them. As such, I think it would be wrong to attach a character name to an armor or any costume tag from Honkai in general, with some specific exceptions. Example: The Kiana Kaslana (White Comet) tag is, as its name says, Kiana Kaslana wearing a White Comet armor/battlesuit. However, that battlesuit isn't unique to her so what should I do when there are other characters wearing it? I don't really think that using Kiana Kaslana (White Comet) is the right answer. Leaving aside my dislike for attaching character names to costumes/armors, the way things are now makes things kind of complicated when tagging characters.

Now, this could be unrelated to the pertaining discussion, but remember that I previously mentioned there are exceptions to this? You see, Honkai has a 'tendency' for recycling character designs. By that I don't mean the way Fate does it (or at least the most basic way), there are several characters in Honkai that look the same but are otherwise completely different, separated characters. This is thanks not only to quantum fantasy, but also the theme of the game as a whole. Here's something I wrote in the Honkai thread to give you an idea:

Raiden Mei (Shadow Dash) Doesn't have an in-game explanation and the only time it's ever been used in the story is in Yae Kasumi's alternate universe. There she was the Raiden Mei of that timeline, and vastly different to the Mei from the main timeline.
Theresa Apocalypse (Luna Kindred) She's a clone of Kallen Kaslana like the original Theresa, but a different one and only share their appearance. Everything from their backstories to their personalities is different. She was introduced in an event story and has since had appearances in multiple other events. The original Theresa is also in some of them, which sets them further apart.
Theresa Apocalypse (Sakura Rondo) Actual battlesuit name is Sakuno Rondo. From the main timeline, this is basically Theresa's body being possesed by the Previous Era's Herrscher of Corruption, who's currently tagged as Higokumaru. Fan artists take some liberties with the possession part, and the events set in alternate universes also normally ignore that aspect.
Theresa Apocalypse (Starlit Astrologos) This is basically Honkai Impact's Zhuge Kongming, who happens to look like Theresa. Kind of a doppelganger thing. Her event storyline takes place in an alternate universe, but it's also implied she existed in the main timeline in ancient times (around the time the real life Zhuge Kongming existed).
Rita Rossweisse (Maid of Celestia) This is Rita from Zhuge Kongming's timeline. She was basically Zhuge's best friend and right hand.
Rita Rossweisse (Fallen Rosemary) This is Irene Adler from an alternate timeline. Irene Adler apparently also existed in the main timeline but the stigmata artwork suggests she didn't look like Rita.
Yae Sakura (Goushinnso Memento) At the beginning she was just a character from an in-universe videogame, but then the company retconned her to be the Sakura from the Previous Era. She's not the same as Yae Sakura (Current Era), the girl with miko outfit, therfore the "Yae" in her name is wrong. It's not explained yet why some Previous Era characters look like some Current Era ones, but this is not an exclusive case. It's not reincarnation as there's proof against that, and Previous Era survivors are aware of this fact.
Yae Sakura (Darkbolt Jonin) This is going to get a little confusing but bear with me. This is Yae Kasumi, her event story happens in an alternate universe. It's later revealed that Kasumi is that alternate universe's Yae Sakura but her soul was transferred to another clone body (which caused her severe amnesia) due to her original body being possessed by the Previous Era's Herrscher of Corruption. At the end of the day she's still considered a different character since she didn't retain almost anything from Yae Sakura other than some emotions, and she sees herself as Kasumi.
Kallen Kaslana (Ritual Imayoh) She's a character from a videogame Otto Apocalypse made. So not the actual Kallen.
Kallen Kaslana (Sin Hunter) She's Kallen from Luna Kindred's timeline. She was dead initially but Otto from that timeline created Luna Kindred with the objective to revive her.

There are also tags like Kiana Kaslana (Herrscher of the Void) that is basically Kiana's body being taken over by Sirin and other similar cases. I'll write the details later because it's kinda late right now.

I've left a reply to that in topic #17375. Imo each game should get its own thread, it's no use to try and argue about different games with different rules and try to make them all fit into one single guideline. Prismatic pegs in round holes and all that.

If we try to make a single guideline blindly we'll just end up having something that satisfies nobody.

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