Mass Update/change Junko's (Touhou) and Skadi's(arknights) headwear tag

BUR #28803 has been rejected.

mass update junko_(touhou) phoenix_crown -> -phoenix_crown dianzi
mass update skadi_(arknights) phoenix_crown -> -phoenix_crown dianzi

Junko has been incorrectly tagged with phoenix crown for a long time.

She should be tagged with the headwear dianzi (钿子) instead.

Skadi also has the same issue.

I've collected images that showcase the differences in a clear manner, side-by-side with the characters:

asset #22218651

Image sources, from left to right
post #5636757 | post #5467113 | x | x
-
post #7321992| post #6720736| x | x
-
post #2440544 | post #6990225 | x | x

Please let me know of other characters that might have this issue.

dianzi is a hat that's supposed to look like a ring, but these character are wearing a fantasy version that often looks nothing like the real life version. Are we sure we want to add all these random pics under dianzi?

For example post #7596244 or post #7448860 are not ring shapes, it's just a tall front. It's "junko's hat", not a dianzi.

nonamethanks said:

dianzi is a hat that's supposed to look like a ring, but these character are wearing a fantasy version that often looks nothing like the real life version. Are we sure we want to add all these random pics under dianzi?

For example post #7596244 or post #7448860 are not ring shapes, it's just a tall front. It's "junko's hat", not a dianzi.

I can kind of see your side. It's like the Wanderer's character tag occupying the jingasa headwear tag -- because while it's true the character's headwear bears a resembles to a jingasa (being inspired by it) it is still, in a sense, so unique in design that it's more of a parody. And it doesn't take long to find everyone draws it differently in terms of shape n size, given how complex it is (unless they trace the 3D model). And also, as a downside (like you stated), if you want to find more 'authentic' jingasa while browsing, you have to put exclusion tags for said character in the searchbar.

Still though, adulterating historical clothing to incorporate into modern character design is commonplace, so that's largely where I disagree.

(At the very least, though, the phoenix crown tag should be removed from both characters. I'll leave this as if for a while longer, unless it fades into the ether, in which case I'll throw in another poll here)

Touhou Wiki is calling Junko's hat a "dalachi" (大拉翅), and even there is a tag for it here. So Touhou Wiki is wrong?

Running a Duckduckgo search with both terms, I noticed a few pictures overlapped in the results, which does not help me get a clear look of how a dianzi is different from a dalachi

Ourobouro said:

I can kind of see your side. It's like the Wanderer's character tag occupying the jingasa headwear tag -- because while it's true the character's headwear bears a resembles to a jingasa (being inspired by it) it is still, in a sense, so unique in design that it's more of a parody. And it doesn't take long to find everyone draws it differently in terms of shape n size, given how complex it is (unless they trace the 3D model). And also, as a downside (like you stated), if you want to find more 'authentic' jingasa while browsing, you have to put exclusion tags for said character in the searchbar.

Still though, adulterating historical clothing to incorporate into modern character design is commonplace, so that's largely where I disagree.

(At the very least, though, the phoenix crown tag should be removed from both characters. I'll leave this as if for a while longer, unless it fades into the ether, in which case I'll throw in another poll here)

Well I checked photos with all of that headwears, and I can say what Junko and Skadi exactly wearing a phoenix crown, dalachi has a different shape and Junko only wear it in post #5068190 or post #4852488 and on another fanarts (and her official art) shape of her hat is completely different, dianzi has a ring shape, if you take closer look you will see what Junko and Skadi's hat is another shape, it’s actual phoenix crown

The current definition of phoenix crown in the wiki does not match what they actually mean in real life. Some examples of phoenix crowns: 1, 2, 3. What Junko is wearing is definitely closer to a dalachi: 4, 5

Thank you all for your inputs and interest in the topic!

I'd been wracking my brain trying to research dianzi and dalachi. It's especially tricky given I have to rely on translators.

What I've found is that dianzi (钿子) translates literally to 'hair pin'. Which means it likely just refers to the hair ornaments, so the term itself has been used wrongly by me. I believe the correct terminology for Junko and Skadi's headwear would be the Qitou (旗头), which is the umbrella term that covers dalachi, liangbatou and any other headwear that resembles overarching hairbands. It translates literally to 'flag head'.

Here is some image examples of different variants; and some more here, here, here, and here...

Here is a gif of an actress trying on a qitou, to give a better view.

Basically, Qitou come in a variety of sizes and shapes, but they share the characteristic of resembling headwear (or hairstyle) that arches over the scalp, similar to a tiara or - like its literal translation - a 'flag'.

@shemingwan_wen I agree, the phoenix crown wiki is vague. The tag is full of mistagged headwear. :HinaUoh:

@Iroshi Please let me know what you think about this revised input (sorry about the response delay).

@Marble_Crescent If you image search 鳳冠 (Chinese for Phoenix Crown) on a search engine, the visual results are very different from Junko's headwear. Or even just the Wikipedia page.

This new information about the qitou leaves me with the general impression that it could be, indeed, a closer match for Junko's headwear in terms of precision. Positively satisfied by your research, I am retracting my original downvote against the BUR

If you have the time or the willforce to go the extra mile, I wonder if you could bring up the topic or ask in Touhou Wiki regarding the definitive name for her hat. They could be linked to this thread and see what they think. But at the end of the day, it might not be that important given I do not use their wiki for tagging clothes in Danbooru

The bulk update request #28803 (forum #294044) has been rejected by @Ourobouro.