I propose this:
- Sex -> Intercourse: any kind of intimate insertion. This absolutely includes oral.
- A creation of an all encompassing tag for any sexual act under the sun.
Posted under Tags
I suggest making an umbrella tag called sex_act for any sex acts, while renaming sex to intercourse in order to not have two similar-sounding tags for different things. As far as I'm aware, the word "intercourse" is usually associated with penetrative sex so that shouldn't be a problem.
AngryZapdos said:
I suggest making an umbrella tag called sex_act for any sex acts, while renaming sex to intercourse in order to not have two similar-sounding tags for different things. As far as I'm aware, the word "intercourse" is usually associated with penetrative sex so that shouldn't be a problem.
Shouldn't sex act be rather sexual act, to include spooning/scissoring/etc? Although it would also mean masturbation would go in there...
"Intercourse" is... eh?
We have things like thigh sex (which should be intercrural intercourse since we also go with blowjob -> fellatio) that don't have any penetration.
.Dank said:
- Sex -> Intercourse: any kind of intimate insertion. This absolutely includes oral.
One concern with this is that if someone wanted to narrow it down to just anal or vaginal, such as with intercourse anal, then you would also get things like post #2470682, since the respective tags aren't limited to "penile insertion" specifically. A Sex anal/vaginal search already has this problem with things like post #3802125. Not necessarily a major problem, but it is there.
Fellatio is already its own tag, so there's not much reason to include the act in another tag besides it also being "intercourse", potential umbrella tags not withstanding.
Oral_sex does have insertion of the penis into the mouth...
Intercourse would imply intimate acts. Meaning toys and insertions besides the users own body wouldn't count. It would for anal/vaginal (toys and the like) but not for intercourse.
Updated
.Dank said:
Oral_sex does have insertion of the penis into the mouth...
Intercourse would imply intimate acts. Meaning toys and insertions besides the users own body wouldn't count. It would for anal/vaginal (toys and the like) but not for intercourse.
Assuming this was directed at me, you misunderstood my point. post #2470682 would appear in an intercourse anal search specifically because your suggestion is that intercourse would include fellatio, while anal is not limited to insertion with a penis. post #2470682 is a false positive in an intercourse anal search because she is performing oral sex and has a sex toy inserted anally.
Intercourse vaginal would include images of characters being penetrated with a penis orally or anally while being penetrated vaginally with anything but a penis, intercourse anal/oral would be the same just swapping around oral, vaginal, and anal.
Intercourse fellatio is the only search of the four that works as intended, but that's only because fellatio is already specifically limited to pleasuring a penis with one's mouth. This also makes it a completely useless search because fellatio already does what intercourse is trying to do for it, but "anal/vaginal penile insertion" have no such unique tags.
Making sure the name and definition of a tag match with how an average user would expect a tag to be used to minimize mistagging and confusion is only one part of the process. Making sure tags are actually useful for searching and don't produce too many false positives is also very important. Making changes that make a search muddier because it's "more accurate" should be something to avoid where possible. I don't disagree with renaming sex, but I don't see any value in also redefining it to include fellatio when it's already a searchable term by itself.
(I got lengthy with it, apologies)
I don't know why you keep insisting on making intercourse anal and the like. It is not the intent to replace anal,vaginal nor fellatio.
And to say that oral technically fits the definition of intercourse but not to be used as such, is more confusing than anything.
Mysterious_Uploader said:
"Intercourse" is... eh?
We have things like thigh sex (which should be intercrural intercourse since we also go with blowjob -> fellatio) that don't have any penetration.
I was referring to this, when I said fellatio does have insertion of the penis into the mouth and so it fits intercourse.
blindVigil said:
post #2470682 is a false positive in an intercourse anal search because she is performing oral sex and has a sex toy inserted anally.
How is this a false positive? It is fellatio, intercourse and anal.
For Danbooru purposes, sex has always meant actual fucking, where fucking means vaginal or anal sex. Strap-ons count for this purpose. We need a tag for actual fucking and, for better or worse, sex is that tag.
Changing the meaning or name of sex now would be too disruptive. Especially when on all other boorus, and most porn sites in general, sex means actual fucking. Imagine going on Danbooru, searching for sex, then getting a bunch of footjobs and fingering and whatever else. Then being told you need to search for intercourse now to get actual sex. It's a joke, nobody goes on a porn site and types in 'penile penetration' or 'intercourse' when they're looking for actual sex. We have a really bad tendency here of workshopping things to death until we come up with tags normal people would never search for.
The problem here is that the word 'sex' is ambiguous even in real life. Sometimes people use it to mean actual fucking (vaginal or anal sex), and sometimes people use it to mean sex acts in general. Even when you say it means sex in general, which acts count can be debatable. Some people might say blowjobs and handjobs count, but not grinding or dry humping. Some people might say tribadism and fingering counts, but not breast sucking or thigh straddling. People have different expectations about what counts as sex, and often they treat their own definitions as totally obvious and commonsense and other definitions as wrong and stupid, as seen in this thread.
If you favor a broad definition of sex and say it's any kind of sexual activity imaginable, then that's basically what rating:explicit already is. Or more precisely, rating:e -solo. I don't necessarily disagree with having a tag for sex acts in general, but I think a broad definition would basically end up being the same thing as rating:e -solo, and a narrow definition would run into the same problem we have now, where people are unhappy because certain acts are excluded.
.Dank said:
I don't know why you keep insisting on making intercourse anal and the like. It is not the intent to replace anal,vaginal nor fellatio.
How is this a false positive? It is fellatio, intercourse and anal.
Intercourse anal was intended to be a multitag search. I completely forgot how to actually do the formatting to represent a search, that's my bad.
In a search using the tags intercourse and anal where the former includes fellatio, post #2470682 is a false positive if one is specifically looking for someone's ass being penetrated by a dick. Sex anal doesn't have this problem, because sex excludes fellatio from its definition, done so because as evazion said, we need a tag that's specifically for "actual fucking" and fellatio is already its own tag, like every other named sex act.
(I must have blanked out while I was writing this cause I was pretty sure I was rewriting something I hadn't sent yet, not editing something I had already posted)
Updated
Fair. Then leave sex as is.
And if we do want an all encompassing sexual act tag Sexual intercourse it's defined on Wikipidea.
blindVigil said:
Intercourse anal was intended to be a search, something I made clear multiple times. It was not a suggestion for a tag. My apologies if that intention was unclear, but I pretty blatantly referred to it as a search in which a person is specifically trying to find images depicting "penises inside asses." post #2470682 is a false positive in a search that is specifically looking someone's ass being fucked by a dick, because that is very clearly not what it is happening here.
I see what you mean now. You had me confused by making intercourse and anal and single tag. But anyways this whole post deviated from answering the OP question.
evazion said:
For Danbooru purposes, sex has always meant actual fucking, where fucking means vaginal or anal sex. Strap-ons count for this purpose. We need a tag for actual fucking and, for better or worse, sex is that tag.
Changing the meaning or name of sex now would be too disruptive. Especially when on all other boorus, and most porn sites in general, sex means actual fucking. Imagine going on Danbooru, searching for sex, then getting a bunch of footjobs and fingering and whatever else. Then being told you need to search for intercourse now to get actual sex. It's a joke, nobody goes on a porn site and types in 'penile penetration' or 'intercourse' when they're looking for actual sex. We have a really bad tendency here of workshopping things to death until we come up with tags normal people would never search for.
The problem here is that the word 'sex' is ambiguous even in real life. Sometimes people use it to mean actual fucking (vaginal or anal sex), and sometimes people use it to mean sex acts in general. Even when you say it means sex in general, which acts count can be debatable. Some people might say blowjobs and handjobs count, but not grinding or dry humping. Some people might say tribadism and fingering counts, but not breast sucking or thigh straddling. People have different expectations about what counts as sex, and often they treat their own definitions as totally obvious and commonsense and other definitions as wrong and stupid, as seen in this thread.
If you favor a broad definition of sex and say it's any kind of sexual activity imaginable, then that's basically what rating:explicit already is. Or more precisely, rating:e -solo. I don't necessarily disagree with having a tag for sex acts in general, but I think a broad definition would basically end up being the same thing as rating:e -solo, and a narrow definition would run into the same problem we have now, where people are unhappy because certain acts are excluded.
+1
.Dank said:
I see what you mean now. You had me confused by making intercourse and anal and single tag. But anyways this whole post deviated from answering the OP question.
That was my bad, yeah.
I would also like to say, I would actually support aliasing sex to a new name if we could decide on one that's appropriate. An alias would keep the ability to do a sex search, though I suppose it might not do much to deter mistagging.
evazion said:
For Danbooru purposes, sex has always meant actual fucking, where fucking means vaginal or anal sex. Strap-ons count for this purpose.
Should strap-on penetration be considered sex though? I always thought it was object_insertion, and the wiki for sex has specified penile penetration for years. Because, if strap-ons are sex, shouldn't all forms of dildo penetration (besides masturbation) be sex too?
SSJG said:
Should strap-on penetration be considered sex though? I always thought it was object_insertion, and the wiki for sex has specified penile penetration for years. Because, if strap-ons are sex, shouldn't all forms of dildo penetration (besides masturbation) be sex too?
I think a strap-on is close enough to the real thing in most ways for it to count, I support tagging strap-on sex with sex.
Unbreakable said:
I think a strap-on is close enough to the real thing in most ways for it to count, I support tagging strap-on sex with sex.
That doesn't feel quite right. If the sex tag had 100% correct use, then yuri+sex would only give strap-on results, which would be redundant. Considering strap-ons to be "close enough to the real thing" while regular dildos aren't, seems very arbitrary to me.
SSJG said:
That doesn't feel quite right. If the sex tag had 100% correct use, then yuri+sex would only give strap-on results, which would be redundant. Considering strap-ons to be "close enough to the real thing" while regular dildos aren't, seems very arbitrary to me.
I think for the purposes of Danbooru, "actual fucking" as it's being referred to here can be more or less be defined as, "thrusting one's hips against another's hips resulting in vaginal or anal penetration." The use of a strap-on to penetrate someone's ass or vagina definitely fits that definition.
Also, a strap-on can be present without it being used, and they can be used on males as well, which obviously wouldn't get the yuri tag under most circumstances. Yuri sex would thus usually exclude such images.
Related question, if penetration with a strap-on counts as sex, does fellating a strap-on count as fellatio?
There absolutely should be a more ambiguous tag if we keep sex in its current form or rename it for clarity. Searching for artwork can be tricky in its current form, especially if you're looking for images that may feature sexy poses and what not but are looking to avoid sex acts and aftermath.
If a more ambiguous tag were to be created though, would masturbation count towards this tag? I personally would define sex act as any action taken for the purpose of sexual gratification. However, I would also find it acceptable to use the definition "an act performed with another for sexual gratification," which would not include masturbation.
Travley_ZeroFaithedHypocrite said:
mass update sex yuri -> -sex yurimight be one possible solution, but...
I will piggyback on this thread
i asked how to tag imminent sex but for yuri. No answer because sex somehow doesn't count yuri?