Is there some way to see characters with no alias attached?

So, basically what I want is a way to search for a list of touhou characters (don't know if they imply touhou copyright) that have no aliases attached to them. That way I can quickly see which ones don't have an alias for First_Last -> Last_First and mass-suggest those aliases be added.

I think Marisa and Reimu are the only ones with name order aliases. A couple more like Reiuji_Utsuho and Kaenbyou_Rin have aliases, but not for name order.

I don't really think we should progress with mass-suggesting name-order aliases. First it will Touhou, then it will be very other copyright because "If all Touhou chars get it, why not the other ones too?"

Especially since some of the other series may have even more obscure surnames than Touhou's.

NNescio said:

I don't really think we should progress with mass-suggesting name-order aliases. First it will Touhou, then it will be very other copyright because "If all Touhou chars get it, why not the other ones too?"

Especially since some of the other series may have even more obscure surnames than Touhou's.

I disagree as a lot of characters come to be known by their given name so it becomes more difficult to search for them when you may not remember their family name off-hand. On top of that, Sakuya doesn't have an alias and is the only character that uses a Last_First tag from that game despite living with and being named by a westerner (Remilia)

Lobuttomize said:

I disagree as a lot of characters come to be known by their given name so it becomes more difficult to search for them when you may not remember their family name off-hand. On top of that, Sakuya doesn't have an alias and is the only character that uses a Last_First tag from that game despite living with and being named by a westerner (Remilia)

Same argument applies to nearly every single Japanese character (Naruto ones especially, because that fanbase seem to have a tendency not to remember surnames, cf. topic #14525). Other than the school setting ones where their surnames pop up more often.

And most Touhou fans know "Izayoi".

Though I suppose introducing aliases for some of the harder to remember ones may be appropriate. This would depend on "missed search" statistics though. But blanket aliasing every single name? That's out of the question. Might as well just, say, change our policy for Touhou names and make them all PersonalName_Surname order instead of bothering with the aliases.

BUR #5954 has been rejected.

Characters are almost always referred to by their given name, meaning people are more familiar with the given name and will likely think to search for that name first. Some family names are also difficult to remember how to spell such as Kamishirasawa or Shameimaru

Lobuttomize said:

I disagree as a lot of characters come to be known by their given name so it becomes more difficult to search for them when you may not remember their family name off-hand. On top of that, Sakuya doesn't have an alias and is the only character that uses a Last_First tag from that game despite living with and being named by a westerner (Remilia)

Sakuya's name is officially 十六夜　咲夜 "Izayoi Sakuya", despite being named by a westerner her name is a proper Japanese name.

I agree with utility aliases though, especially with the growing number of localized Touhou games, official or fan made, that are using western name order. As long as we exclude things like "Futo Mononobe", I'd strongly prefer not to encourage that nonsense.

I don't really see a problem with western order aliases in general.

NNescio said:

Same argument applies to nearly every single Japanese character (Naruto ones especially, because that fanbase seem to have a tendency not to remember surnames, cf. topic #14525). Other than the school setting ones where their surnames pop up more often.

And most Touhou fans know "Izayoi".

Though I suppose introducing aliases for some of the harder to remember ones may be appropriate. This would depend on "missed search" statistics though. But blanket aliasing every single name? That's out of the question. Might as well just, say, change our policy for Touhou names and make them all PersonalName_Surname order instead of bothering with the aliases.

Seeing as it's a western website, I'd agree with doing that. Either way, I don't see a real downside to allowing people to search for a name written either way.

blindVigil said:

Sakuya's name is officially 十六夜　咲夜 "Izayoi Sakuya", despite being named by a westerner her name is a proper Japanese name.

I agree with utility aliases though, especially with the growing number of localized Touhou games, official or fan made, that are using western name order. As long as we exclude things like "Futo Mononobe", I'd strongly prefer not to encourage that nonsense.

I don't really see a problem with western order aliases in general.

Yeah, I just meant that people may believe otherwise because of her being around westerners and named by a westerner

The dull and labor intensive way is checking every chartag in touhou's related tags:

https://danbooru.donmai.us/related_tag?search%5Bquery%5D=touhou&search%5Bcategory%5D=Character&commit=Show

Aliases introduce server load. The occasional one doesn't matter, but if every single character with Japanese naming order gets a Western naming order, that just a bunch of pointless load. And if those aliases are necessary in the first place (somehow)... might as well change our policy and use Western name order for every single Japanese character barring the archaic "Surname no Personal Name" names that might sound awkward otherwise.

Because that's the much more efficient approach to do things.
(Or, if we don't want a blanket change, then just Touhou characters.)

NNescio said:

Aliases introduce server load. The occasional one doesn't matter, but if every single character with Japanese naming order gets a Western naming order, that just a bunch of pointless load. And if those aliases are necessary in the first place (somehow)... might as well change our policy and use Western name order for every single Japanese character barring the archaic "Surname no Personal Name" names that might sound awkward otherwise.

Because that's the much more efficient approach to do things.
(Or, if we don't want a blanket change, then just Touhou characters.)

I can't imagine aliases increase server load very much, if at all, but I could be wrong

Incidentally I and, considering the status quo, expect most to also agree with nnescio. Hopefully autocomplete can be tweaked to cater to how foreigners remember a character; not many will remember the character surname which is needed to browse danbooru effectively. For instance yande.re has a satisfactory system for this see: (https://yande.re/post?tags=taiga+) yet I can't assert how it is handled behind the scenes.

ljhkhjkghjybtvhyt said:

Incidentally I and, considering the status quo, expect most to also agree with nnescio. Hopefully autocomplete can be tweaked to cater to how foreigners remember a character; not many will remember the character surname which is needed to browse danbooru effectively. For instance yande.re has a satisfactory system for this see: (https://yande.re/post?tags=taiga+) yet I can't assert how it is handled behind the scenes.

That would be ideal

Another consideration is that mass aliasing will also clog up autocomplete lists. It's less of a problem for less populated tags, but Touhou chars are highly populated. Aliasing Sakuya_Izayoi to Izayoi_Sakuya in particular will knock out the sakura_blossoms (-> cherry_blossoms) tag for "sak" autocomplete. (Also sakuya_tsuitachi for "sakura").

Perhaps the cost of inconveniencing people to needing to type out "sakur" instead of just "sak" can be justified in this case. That is, just for a single Sakuya_Izayoi to Izayoi_Sakuya alias (reason being that some people might potentially be confused by her name using Eastern naming order, as you mentioned). But mass aliasing all Touhou chars will likely cause multiple such problems to pop up, and the 'costs' will add up.

ljhkhjkghjybtvhyt said:

Incidentally I and, considering the status quo, expect most to also agree with nnescio. Hopefully autocomplete can be tweaked to cater to how foreigners remember a character; not many will remember the character surname which is needed to browse danbooru effectively. For instance yande.re has a satisfactory system for this see: (https://yande.re/post?tags=taiga+) yet I can't assert how it is handled behind the scenes.

If a tag has fewer than 16 posts it'll look for suggestions—if only one underscore is contained, it splits on _, reverses, then re-joins with an _ (eg taiga_aisaka -> aisaka_taiga). Then whether or not it contains exactly one underscore it does an SQL LIKE query and picks 6 tags by descending post count.

Are people trying to argue to not add these aliases? There is no disadvantage to adding them, and only advantages. I for one forget the family names of characters a lot, and there's also the fact that multiple characters can share a family name. Inaba for example, if you search for Inaba you get multiple suggestions but if you searched for Tewi you would only get Tewi. I see no reason to not have these aliases.

NNescio said:

Aliases introduce server load. The occasional one doesn't matter, but if every single character with Japanese naming order gets a Western naming order, that just a bunch of pointless load. And if those aliases are necessary in the first place (somehow)... might as well change our policy and use Western name order for every single Japanese character barring the archaic "Surname no Personal Name" names that might sound awkward otherwise.

Because that's the much more efficient approach to do things.
(Or, if we don't want a blanket change, then just Touhou characters.)

Ok, this actually makes sense as a reason to not do it, I didn't even think about that.

The "disadvantage" is the server load. It's also just kicking the can down the road since these are not the only characters on Danbooru who have a Japanese name order. It would be better to think of a better solution instead of just aliasing every character.

Also imagine if, one day, a character appears that has the same name as another character but only in reverse order for some reason. Maybe not very likely but not impossible.