[REJECTED] Tag implication: g36 -> heckler_&_koch

create implication g36 -> heckler_&_koch

Link to implication

EDIT: The tag implication g36 -> heckler_&_koch (forum #152846) has been rejected by @Type-kun.

I know we have other implications for heckler & koch, but why do we need umbrella tags for gun manufacturers to begin with? We don't do this for other companies, like car makers or videogame consoles. We're not even doing it for all guns - see colt_*, sig_*, mauser_*, winchester_*.

If we just standardized the naming to h&k_* then we wouldn't need implications, you could just use a wildcard search instead.

evazion said:

If we just standardized the naming to h&k_* then we wouldn't need implications, you could just use a wildcard search instead.

That sounds like a good idea to me. Most of those are named h&k_* already anyway. Go ahead with bulk alias/update request.

The tag implication g36 -> heckler_&_koch (forum #152846) has been rejected by @Type-kun.

evazion said:

... why do we need umbrella tags for gun manufacturers to begin with? We don't do this for other companies, like car makers or videogame consoles.

I thought we did do this for cars. There's toyota, nissan, etc. that are tagged on most of the posts that include their cars. They aren't implied and sometimes get missed - for example, there are results for nissan_gt-r -nissan - but most nissan_gt-r posts are also tagged nissan without having anything to do with Nissan the company/brand other than one of their cars being present. Same appears true for lamborghini_aventador (lamborghini_aventador -lamborghini), porsche_911 (porsche_911 -porsche), etc.

Am I understanding the status quo wrong?

I recall seeing a post where someone was wearing a branded shirt or hat, so you still have that problem that a wildcard search wouldn't solve.

remove implication hk417 -> heckler_&_koch
remove implication hk416 -> heckler_&_koch
remove implication hk_mark_23 -> heckler_&_koch
remove implication h&k_usp -> heckler_&_koch
remove implication h&k_ump -> heckler_&_koch
remove implication h&k_mp7 -> heckler_&_koch
remove implication h&k_mp5k -> heckler_&_koch
remove implication h&k_mp5 -> heckler_&_koch
remove implication h&k_mp5sd -> heckler_&_koch

Link to request

Remove all existing heckler & koch implications. The other issue with these implications is that this company has dozens of weapons (see the heckler & koch wiki), but many are too small for implications. It wouldn't make sense for some tags to imply the company while others don't.

EDIT: The bulk update request #1921 (forum #153722) has been approved by @Hillside_Moose.

create alias g11 -> h&k_g11
create alias g36 -> h&k_g36
create alias hk417 -> h&k_hk417
create alias hk416 -> h&k_hk416
create alias hk_mark_23 -> h&k_mark_23
create alias psg-1 -> h&k_psg1

Link to request

Standardize on h&k_* for all heckler & koch weapons. These are aliases instead of mass updates because these tags have implications. References:

• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_G11
• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_HK417
• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_HK416
• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_Mark_23
• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_PSG1
• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:HK_firearms

EDIT: The bulk update request #1922 (forum #153723) has been approved by @Hillside_Moose.

evazion said:
If we just standardized the naming to h&k_* then we wouldn't need implications, you could just use a wildcard search instead.

Just saying, but doesn't that mean even builders/mod+ would not see all of them with the wildcard, given that wildcards only show as much tags as an user's tag limit?

☆♪ said:

I thought we did do this for cars. There's toyota, nissan, etc. that are tagged on most of the posts that include their cars. They aren't implied and sometimes get missed - for example, there are results for nissan_gt-r -nissan - but most nissan_gt-r posts are also tagged nissan without having anything to do with Nissan the company/brand other than one of their cars being present. Same appears true for lamborghini_aventador (lamborghini_aventador -lamborghini), porsche_911 (porsche_911 -porsche), etc.

Am I understanding the status quo wrong?

I don't think tagging companies is a good practice in general. Not unless there's a direct reference to a brand or something. It leads to people doing stuff like tagging every Nintendo-related thing under the sun as Nintendo, or randomly tagging Fate posts as Type-Moon.

With guns especially, there usually aren't identifiable logos and there's not necessarily much visually in common between, say, a handgun and a sniper rifle produced by the same company. It basically amounts to tagging what you know and not what you see.

I think it's better to name tags consistently and to make tag groups in the wiki than to create umbrella tags and implications just for the sake of doing it.

nonamethanks said:

Just saying, but doesn't that mean even builders/mod+ would not see all of them with the wildcard, given that wildcards only show as much tags as an user's tag limit?

That's true, but I don't see it as a big deal. The same is true for fn_*, beretta_*, and colt_*. Those companies don't have umbrella tags either.

I mean, there's no easy search to find, say, every home console made by Nintendo, but that doesn't mean we have to have one either.

The bulk update request #1921 (forum #153722) has been approved by @Hillside_Moose.

The bulk update request #1922 (forum #153723) has been approved by @Hillside_Moose.