Finding an alternative name for "cuntboy"

BUR #24218 has been rejected.

create alias cuntboy -> male_newhalf

Coming across this artist POV made me consider that the longer we keep using cuntboy the more we subject ourselves to artists disliking to see their content on here. Which could result in more negative rep and takedown requests our way so I think that finding a less offensive word to use is an important thing to be discussed.

The less reasons we give artists to hate us the better, I think.

After a discussion on the discord male newhalf is the name that seemed the least offensive and most consistent with our current tagging methods considering that we currently use futanari and male futanari. Cuntboy in this case will just be the male equivalent to newhalf just how topless male is to topless.

BUR #24219 has been rejected.

create alias cuntboy -> vagina_boy

An alternative tag name that gets the point across more directly, alebit more awkwardly, but importantly without the offensive nature of the word “cuntboy”.

English isn’t my native language and even I feel icky using that term. Even if it is a commonly used word in the porn scene, it just reads like an obvious insult.

pussy boy has similar connotations so it wasn’t an option.

While I agree on renaming the tag to something less vulgar-sounding, I disagree with using newhalf in any capacity relative to newhalf's use on Danbooru. Per topic #22189, the way we use newhalf doesn't really jell with how it is used in normal people circles, and can be seen as offensive too. We even had an incident a week ago where user #1151420 updated a few wikis to change 'newhalf' to 'vaginaless futanari' (a more accurate name for how we use it)... without actually updating any posts, rendering the wiki edits pointless. With the loaded nature of the term, it would be best for us to move away from using 'newhalf' in any futa contexts, including renaming newhalf itself (thus leaving the term 'newhalf' for art that actually depicts them, ala forum #222901, or seeing how it can work relative to male with breasts per topic #22122 and topic #24031).

Of course, that doesn't solve the issue present here. I'd lean closer to vaginaboy of the two terms proposed, but even that isn't exactly the best solution here. We can't look to the Japanese for solutions, because, assuming Pixiv is accurate on this, all their terms for this are borrowed from English circles, so all of them feature the same issue as 'cuntboy', with the exception of 'andromorph', only because that has its own issues (like using a term that literally just means "being with male physical characteristics" to refer to a specific fetish about male characters with vaginas, so it isn't intuitive in the slightest, no normal person would use it). We might have to come up with our own term, if it comes to it.

If we're going to parallel 'cuntboy' with 'newhalf' (relative to use on-site), then we may as well have the tag, whatever it ends up being called, imply male futanari.

BUR #24220 has been rejected.

create alias cuntboy -> male_with_vagina

From what I see, IRL newhalf is only used for AMAB people with connection to femininity (transgender women and crossdressers). Our definition of newhalf is already a mess that has barely anything to do with IRL terminology, let's not make it worse than it is.

How about this? Simple, descriptive, doesn't invoke any niche terminology. The only drawback is people tagging it on male futanari, but to be fair, it's already strange our male-with-a-vagina tags don't have an umbrella while female-with-a-penis tags do. Additionally we could rename male_futanari to male_with_vagina_and_penis buuuut I don't think that's necessary.

KagayakuShiningGate said:

How about this? Simple, descriptive, doesn't invoke any niche terminology.

I think that plays against it more than it does for it. Shifting away from a specific term (common or made-up by us) to a generalized description strips it from its fetish context and might broaden it too much beyond it. There's also a point against it in so far as people might see it as the start of a domino topple, one that'd eventually end with moving futanari to "female_with_vagina_and_penis".

BUR #24228 has been rejected.

create alias malefuta -> male_futanari
create implication cuntboy -> male_futanari
create alias penisless_malefuta -> cuntboy
create alias cuntboy -> penisless_male_futanari

After sleeping on it, I realized something. If we're going all in on rendering 'newhalf' as the parallel to 'cuntboy' (which technically makes newhalf 'dickgirl' in the Japanese futa sense, in contrast to how some Western futa absolutists/purists argue 'dickgirl' is an overarching term that includes futanari), then in turn would it not make sense to adapt the proposed solution for the former to the latter?

Now, there are some complications in regards to this, and that's the *_with_* tags. While Ver had proposed nuking them in the advent of newhalf's renaming, given the potential jankiness of, say, pussyless_futa_with_male or vaginaless_futa_with_female (whatever that one would be called relative to the terminology used on site), if we do keep them for the granular futa tags then that'd be the only choice, which leaves male futanari in a pickle, as that'd be "penisless male futanari with male", an absolute clusterfuck of a mouthful. That's why I'm proposing the shortened 'malefuta' as a utility alias for male futanari, and using that in its place, giving us penisless_malefuta_with_male, which while still long at least doesn't have excessive spacing.

Cuntboy is fine as-is; it's the most popular terminology in both America and Japan. I just wish we used dickgirl instead of newhalf, but I guess that creates ambiguity.

LQ said:

I just wish we used dickgirl instead of newhalf, but I guess that creates ambiguity.

Yeah, especially given that in English these days dickgirl can equally mean "it's just for girls with dicks, no vaginas" and "it's for all girls with dicks, including those with vaginas", so it'd be ambiguous with futanari (which is why dickgirl is aliased to it instead). As newhalf is treated as a subset of futanari (and futa being used as the term for all 'girls with dicks' art), any alternate non-loaded term for it would necessarily have a name derivative of futanari, ala full-package futanari.

But that brings in the point of focus. The reason why futanari is used as the umbrella is because in art, futa overwhelmingly emphasizes the dick over the vagina, because for a lot of folks the appeal is in what looks like a cis woman suddenly having a cock, and using it in ways only dude would imagine, especially if they have cocks bigger than their bodies and nuts fatter than a tanuki's. So it doesn't make sense to make a distinct umbrella that encompasses futanari and 'newhalf' separately, because the ambiguous cases would end up going to the umbrella tag anyway (ala Super Saiyan when you can't tell if the artist meant SSJ1 or SSJ2).

As such, if the focus of female futanari is that the female subject in question has a dick more than them having both a dick and a vagina, one can easily reason that the same applies for male futanari in reverse, that the focus is that the male subject has a vagina more than they do a dick. And searching the posts in male futanari, you see that's exactly the case - despite a penis being present more often than not, the focus of the art is directed more towards the vagina, whether it be penetration with finger, tongue, penis or creampie, etc, effectively just like 'cuntboy' (which also means you also have the opportunity for ambiguity, where a malefuta is depicted in a way where their penis isn't shown).

As Shining mentioned, it is strange that we don't have an umbrella tag for "male-with-a-vagina" despite giving "female-with-a-penis" that same honor, especially as you'd imagine there would be people interested in blacklisting the former just as much as they do the latter (and it wouldn't make sense to make a distinct umbrella tag for "male-with-a-vagina", because we didn't do that for "female-with-a-penis"). Given how much more niche the former fetish is, it isn't that surprising, but it does mean that anyone interested in it is forced to do ~male_futanari ~cuntboy to get what they want.

BUR #24358 has been rejected.

create alias cuntboy -> andromorph
create alias newhalf -> gynomorph

There is the e621 option of "andromorph" which means exactly that, but then it might seem weird we don't call "newhalfs" gynomorphs.

https://e621.net/wiki_pages/25738
https://e621.net/wiki_pages/25744

War6t2 said:

There is the e621 option of "andromorph" which means exactly that, but then it might seem weird we don't call "newhalfs" gynomorphs.

https://e621.net/wiki_pages/25738
https://e621.net/wiki_pages/25744

To quote myself from a few posts ago, "'andromorph'... has its own issues (like using a term that literally just means "being with male physical characteristics" to refer to a specific fetish about male characters with vaginas, so it isn't intuitive in the slightest, no normal person would use it)".

e621's use of andromorph/gynomorph gets them a lot of flak on Twitter, whether it be from folks who prefer terms such as 'dickgirl' and 'cuntboy', folks who want proper tagging for trans characters, and from folks who think the chosen words are just stupid and unintuitive. It literally makes no one happy (except the specific bubble of furries who use it and therefore influenced e621 to use it too), so if we wanted to adopt new terms, e621 would be the last place we'd look for inspiration.

Damian0358 said:

To quote myself from a few posts ago, "'andromorph'... has its own issues (like using a term that literally just means "being with male physical characteristics" to refer to a specific fetish about male characters with vaginas, so it isn't intuitive in the slightest, no normal person would use it)".

e621's use of andromorph/gynomorph gets them a lot of flak on Twitter, whether it be from folks who prefer terms such as 'dickgirl' and 'cuntboy', folks who want proper tagging for trans characters, and from folks who think the chosen words are just stupid and unintuitive. It literally makes no one happy (except the specific bubble of furries who use it and therefore influenced e621 to use it too), so if we wanted to adopt new terms, e621 would be the last place we'd look for inspiration.

Fair enough, I know newhalf has it's own controversy but I stil like the solution of "male_newhalf" the most.

The bulk update request #24218 (forum #272457) has been rejected by @nonamethanks.

The bulk update request #24219 (forum #272458) has been rejected by @nonamethanks.

The bulk update request #24228 (forum #272483) has been rejected by @nonamethanks.

The bulk update request #24358 (forum #273025) has been rejected by @nonamethanks.

Admiral_Pectoral said:

BUR #24218 has been rejected.

create alias cuntboy -> male_newhalf

Coming across this artist POV made me consider that the longer we keep using cuntboy the more we subject ourselves to artists disliking to see their content on here. Which could result in more negative rep and takedown requests our way so I think that finding a less offensive word to use is an important thing to be discussed.

The less reasons we give artists to hate us the better, I think.

After a discussion on the discord male newhalf is the name that seemed the least offensive and most consistent with our current tagging methods considering that we currently use futanari and male futanari. Cuntboy in this case will just be the male equivalent to newhalf just how topless male is to topless.

How about reverse_newhalf? Similar to "reverse_trap"

I'm personally over this conversation. Doesn't seem like anything I come up with will solve anything.

This reminds me of how we renamed trap to otoko no ko because it was offensive, but people still call them traps everywhere else so all that achieved is that we're the odd ones out now. Rule34 has 6 times the amount of posts under trap than otoko no ko, for example.
It also reminds me of people routinely having meltdowns over futanari, newhalf, dickgirl, gynomorph or any other permutation of these names because they confuse anime porn with real life and nobody can actually agree on which term is offensive and which one should be used instead.

It's not up to us to sanitize the term for everyone's consumption. This is all the more true when it's a niche fetish that's been around for as long as the internet has been public. cuntboy is what this specific fetish has been called for what has now been decades. Sucks to be the people that don't like the term, but if everyone (especially people jerking off to it) calls them cuntboys that's what people are going to search and refer to them as. If you want to change the name you should do it at the source, not force us to be some kind of moral filter for the rest of art internet.
Look at the pixiv tags. It's カントボーイ and マンコ男. Try to translate those and see what they mean. If someone's going to get butthurt at us for using cuntboy, they're also going to have meltdowns over pixiv using the same hashtags.
Also, think for a second about what you're trying to do here. You're trying to force an alternate name to reduce the offensiveness of what is essentially a fetish about dicks being replaced by pussies on manly men. It's a joke. You know what's more offensive? People accidentally opening this tag without knowing what it is because it got a new name.

The only suggestion that makes sense in this topic is male with vagina/male with pussy, but that can also be confused with male futanari, which is a completely different fetish. Imagine if we mixed peeing and scat just because they share the same function. I highly doubt most people looking at one want to even acknowledge the existence of the other.

Does that mean we can reverse otoko no ko back to trap

nonamethanks said:

This reminds me of how we renamed trap to otoko no ko because it was offensive, but people still call them traps everywhere else so all that achieved is that we're the odd ones out now. Rule34 has 6 times the amount of posts under trap than otoko no ko, for example.

We might be the odd ones out when it comes to boorus but we're also technically frontrunners in normalizing the use of otoko no ko in anime spaces, given how in the years since places like AniList have switched away from trap to otokonoko, so one could definitely argue we'd probably be in a frontrunning position too for a new name for this fetish (though as you said, it would be a way steeper hill to climb in that case, especially with the Japanese adopting the English term for it, so one has to wonder what's the point).

nonamethanks said:

The only suggestion that makes sense in this topic is male with vagina/male with pussy, but that can also be confused with male futanari, which is a completely different fetish.

It's funny how its BUR is the last one standing despite being like, the second most ambiguous.