Suggestions for generalized baby/juvenile/young animal tag

BUR #23844 has been rejected.

create implication kitten -> juvenile_animal
create implication puppy -> juvenile_animal
create implication chick -> juvenile_animal
create implication duckling -> juvenile_animal
create implication foal -> juvenile_animal

Needing a general tag for baby animals that are not of the above tag as well as searching for the above in general. Was in immense debate with myself about whether to call this baby animal or young/juvenile animal as the first is more intuitive initially but the other is better for cases of animals that are clearly not babies but not adults either in which the baby animal tag would be annoying. Created both versions so people could vote. Juvenile could also apply for maybe monsters and such?

BUR #23845 has been rejected.

create implication kitten -> baby_animal
create implication puppy -> baby_animal
create implication chick -> baby_animal
create implication duckling -> baby_animal
create implication foal -> baby_animal

Alt version 1

As for "alt version 2# young_animal is apparently a copyright. https://danbooru.donmai.us/forum_topics/26480

I don't think we need these tags at all.

cub and chick already are generic "baby animal" tags to a degree, except that cub is also filled with furry shota/loli porn because of the fetish connotations of the term.

nonamethanks said:

cub and chick already are generic "baby animal" tags to a degree, except that cub is also filled with furry shota/loli porn because of the fetish connotations of the term.

That's why I wanted a generalized one. Young animal seems best but that bur is still holding up.

Do you need a reminder on what happened to female child?

hdk5 said:

Do you need a reminder on what happened to female child?

I don't think the reasons that tag got nuked really apply here. We're talking about animals, not people that look like children.

BUR #24139 has been rejected.

create implication kitten -> young_animal
create implication puppy -> young_animal
create implication chick -> young_animal
create implication duckling -> young_animal
create implication foal -> young_animal

And finally alt version 2.

Apologies for "finishing" the bur so late. This should have been there at the start but the tag "young animal" was originally a copyright tag with 6 posts a decade ago and I was explicitly told by admins I should make a BUR to rename it and wait for it to go through (which I think is overkill for exactly this reason).

nonamethanks said:

cub and chick already are generic "baby animal" tags to a degree, except that cub is also filled with furry shota/loli porn because of the fetish connotations of the term.

With the aforementioned tons of furry fetish porn, would using one of these suggested tags as an alternative to cub by okay for non bird like baby animals?

Also for the above reasons what about excluding cub in the burs?

The primary problem that I can see with a tag like baby animal is that Pokemon and Digimon have shitton of canonically baby animals, so a baby animal tag would just get filled with poochyena and baby digimons, unless it was only made specifically for actual animals and original/unnamed creatures, but that's something that we'd have to actively fight for as long as such a tag would exist.

We should really be cleaning the furries out of cub. I don't think it makes sense for the tag to be a mix of actual animals and furry porn.

blindVigil said:

We should really be cleaning the furries out of cub. I don't think it makes sense for the tag to be a mix of actual animals and furry porn.

Given how cub has effectively acquired the online definition of furry loli/shota, after a certain point it might just make sense to just disambiguate and deprecate cub, and making two separate tag for actual animal cubs and for furries.

Damian0358 said:

Given how cub has effectively acquired the online definition of furry loli/shota, after a certain point it might just make sense to just disambiguate and deprecate cub, and making two separate tag for actual animal cubs and for furries.

Has it? I don't see anyone outside of furry communities use it that way, and non furries only use it that way when talking about furries. Even checking our own cub tag, the furry pollution was done predominately by a single user and consisted of no more than two pages worth. I think the issue is being overstated, most people still use the word to mean animals.

blindVigil said:

Has it? I don't see anyone outside of furry communities use it that way, and non furries only use it that way when talking about furries. I think the issue is being overstated, most people still use the word to mean animals.

Discord's Community Guidelines list it along with lolicon and shotacon under the "Do not sexualize children in any way" section. Of course, that's rooted in its own Discord-laden context, but at bare minimum there is a decent amount of non-furry users online who are aware that this definition of cub exists. Most people still use the word normally, that's obvious, but most people also don't go on booru websites.

Really, the only thing that argues against my suggestion is what you pointed out, that the furry pollution was done by a single user. If we saw a far larger chunk of users engage in such behavior, it'd be more justified, but with that in mind, it'd be way more preemptive than necessary, so it'd just be easier to garden it into the appropriate furry and loli/shota tags instead.

Damian0358 said:

...it'd just be easier to garden it into the appropriate furry and loli/shota tags instead.

Agreed. We don't need a tag that's just "x but furry" when you can simply add furry to a search (or blacklist line).

nonamethanks said:

The primary problem that I can see with a tag like baby animal is that Pokemon and Digimon have shitton of canonically baby animals, so a baby animal tag would just get filled with poochyena and baby digimons, unless it was only made specifically for actual animals and original/unnamed creatures, but that's something that we'd have to actively fight for as long as such a tag would exist.

Yeah I've gone ahead and removed cub from the BURS. That is definitely going to be a much bigger uphill battle of tag polution than baby pokemon. The main problem with baby animal is that it is BY FAR the most intuitive one but then we run into retarded situations like some animal from a kids movie that is equivalent to a child or teenager being tagged as a baby. Hasn't happened yet, but I can all but guarantee it will. I'm not actually as concerned about baby pokemon as that could just be solved via wiki (and seems much more feasible than changing the slang definition of cub). Perhaps aliasing baby animal to either of the juvenile/young tags so people typing the more intuitive one get the correct tag suggested but avoiding the age related issues above?

blindVigil said:

Has it? I don't see anyone outside of furry communities use it that way, and non furries only use it that way when talking about furries. Even checking our own cub tag, the furry pollution was done predominately by a single user and consisted of no more than two pages worth. I think the issue is being overstated, most people still use the word to mean animals.

Damian0358 said:

Discord's Community Guidelines list it along with lolicon and shotacon under the "Do not sexualize children in any way" section. Of course, that's rooted in its own Discord-laden context, but at bare minimum there is a decent amount of non-furry users online who are aware that this definition of cub exists. Most people still use the word normally, that's obvious, but most people also don't go on booru websites.

Really, the only thing that argues against my suggestion is what you pointed out, that the furry pollution was done by a single user. If we saw a far larger chunk of users engage in such behavior, it'd be more justified, but with that in mind, it'd be way more preemptive than necessary, so it'd just be easier to garden it into the appropriate furry and loli/shota tags instead.

AngryZapdos said:

Agreed. We don't need a tag that's just "x but furry" when you can simply add furry to a search (or blacklist line).

Disagree. Outside of animals where the baby is actually called a cub, eg, a lion cub, the term is pretty much exclusively furry (Hell I think you'd be more likely to see someone call a baby alien an "alien puppy" than a cub). Even if the tag pollution here was done by a single user online the word "cub" (again, when not talking about lion cubs and such) is just about slang for furry porn. I think it could be a situation akin to child vs loli/shota where cub gets the latter and baby/juvenile/young/whatever animal is for actual baby animals.

War6t2 said:

Disagree. Outside of animals where the baby is actually called a cub, eg, a lion cub, the term is pretty much exclusively furry (Hell I think you'd be more likely to see someone call a baby alien an "alien puppy" than a cub). Even if the tag pollution here was done by a single user online the word "cub" (again, when not talking about lion cubs and such) is just about slang for furry porn. I think it could be a situation akin to child vs loli/shota where cub gets the latter and baby/juvenile/young/whatever animal is for actual baby animals.

No one outside furry communities, which are definitely not speaking for the majority of the internet, unironically uses cub that way. The only reason cub even shows up in Discord's community guidelines is because discord is basically run by furries. Anyone else is, at best, aware that furries use it that way, but being aware is not the same as actually using it that way. We don't need to hand cub over to the furries just because a minority of internet communities use it as slang, and some people outside of those communities are aware that it refers to "some furry shit."

Until we actually see users trying to use the tag that way, and one user responsible for less than 40 posts across the last 5 years doesn't count, we can safely ignore that usage of the word. Child, loli, and shota will work fine enough for finding that type of content.

I do agree that you hardly ever see anyone use cub to refer to baby animals in general, but that doesn't really have anything to do with the slang usage. There's no correlation between furries using the word and everyone else not using it. It's not like people forgot the word's original definition, people just don't use the word in everyday conversation.

blindVigil said:

No one outside furry communities, which are definitely not speaking for the majority of the internet, unironically uses cub that way. The only reason cub even shows up in Discord's community guidelines is because discord is basically run by furries. Anyone else is, at best, aware that furries use it that way, but being aware is not the same as actually using it that way. We don't need to hand cub over to the furries just because a minority of internet communities use it as slang, and some people outside of those communities are aware that it refers to "some furry shit."

Until we actually see users trying to use the tag that way, and one user responsible for less than 40 posts across the last 5 years doesn't count, we can safely ignore that usage of the word. Child, loli, and shota will work fine enough for finding that type of content.

I do agree that you hardly ever see anyone use cub to refer to baby animals in general, but that doesn't really have anything to do with the slang usage. There's no correlation between furries using the word and everyone else not using it. It's not like people forgot the word's original definition, people just don't use the word in everyday conversation.

It's rarely used but the meaning is pretty much understood (again outside lion cubs etc) to be reffering to furries. It would be IMO like if we tried to tag yiff as as a fox sound effect (eg, fox girls). Technically possible as it's not common in everyday use but needlessly complicated rather than finding another tag without the connotation.

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